I love you

[ghoti_mhic_uait]

So, sometimes on TV someone says I love you, and the other person says "thankyou" or kisses them or just doesn't say anything. Then there's a whole big thing about it: I can think of two breakups over this very issue (one of which I just went to look up what happened because I thought I missed the split, turns out I was wrong.

Now, is it just me or is there something odd here? "I love you" isn't a question, it isn't a leading statement, it's merely a fact. If the other person doesn't feel that way, then they might later, that's OK, but to say something they don't feel seems unnecessary dishonesty. To break up because you love someone, well, I don't get that. And thankyou is just polite, it means 'I hear what you're saying and I'm glad of it'.

Now, I say I love you a lot. I say it when I mean it, and I don't expect anything in return, because it's not a requirement, it's just a statement of fact. What about you?

Comments

[sashajwolf.livejournal.com]

I do the same as you, but IME we're relatively unusual. Culturally, "I love you" is not just a statement of fact - it's the first half of a call-and-response, with the expected response being "I love you too." If the other person doesn't offer the expected response, the first person is almost inevitably going to feel bad - either because they misjudged the situation by using the "call" too early in the relationship, or if the relationship is more established, because the other person is signalling that their feelings have changed.

[ghoti.livejournal.com]

*nod* so it is, as I thought, a cultural thing that I missed the import of. Thankfully, I've never noticed a partner have this cultural feeling, so it's never been an issue for me.

(Interestingly, Colin said 'I don't think it's as wide as US culture' when I was suggesting that that might be the difference... I also suggested 'notme' culture.)

[pinkdormouse.livejournal.com]

I'm with lizw on the cultural connotations. I'd tell people I love them a lot more if I knew which grouping they fell into as concerns simple statement vs complex exchange.

It's also an issue I come up against when writing: how does this character view the words, how do they expect the other character(s) to respond, how will the other character(s) respond?

[vyvyan.livejournal.com]

If a relationship has always used the convention you describe, then that's fine. But if it had been a common feature of the relationship for years and years, that one person would say, "I love you," and the other would respond, "I love you too,", and then one day the other person didn't say anything at all, I think that would be a clear signal that something had changed! To be sure, the other person might have been lying about it for many years, but the changed behaviour would indicate at least that they were unwilling to keep pretending any longer...

[vyvyan.livejournal.com]

In fact, I don't think it's just romantic/familial relationships that this would apply to. If my closest friend said to me, "You're a really great friend to me, you know?" I'd feel almost obliged to say more than just "Thanks" - I'd want to say, "You're a great friend too" or else risk an embarrassing implication of one-sidedness to the relationship.

[ghoti.livejournal.com]

Interesting. I'd be more likely to go the 'thankyou' route, depending on context.

[philipstorry.livejournal.com]

I have a problem with the word "love" that means I've rarely, if ever, said it to partners.

If someone does say it to me, I tell them how much I care for them. If that response causes an issue, I ask just one thing:
Define "love".

Yes, there's a dictionary definition. But that doesn't work here. If you asked people to define love in terms of sacrifices they'd be willing to make, or in terms of other expectations - well, let's just say I suspect the answers might not always sit well with their partner.

Once the hormonal kick of passion begins to wear off, people are left to reason what love means for them, and whether their relationship fulfils those expectations. If it doesn't, people "fall out of love". (And the confusion caused by this sometimes turns to pain, which leads to nastiness.)

I've come to the conclusion that an inability to articulate what "love" is beyond the obvious physiological effects is probably the main cause of relationships ending, after infidelity of course.

So no, if someone said that they loved me, I'd have no problem not giving the standard response. I'd have more problems giving the standard response, because I'd fear that we were both agreeing on something without defining it.

I fear my response to "I love you" is probably too long for most. The only effective way of expressing it was to say what I appreciate about the person. But that takes more time than "I love you too", and can leave people unfulfilled - even though it's a more genuine response.

I don't like the word "love" much because of this. But that's starting a whole journey into other territory...

[ghoti.livejournal.com]

That makes sense.

[davefish.livejournal.com]

keris: I love you.
davefish: Bizzarro.

[rysmiel.livejournal.com]

I'm entirely with you on this, fwiw. There are many people I am fortunate enough to love, and I communicate it so often as possible, not as a call/response thing, just as an expression of whatever shade of feeling it covers.

[1ngi.livejournal.com]

I think the way it is depicted in tv etc is very lame, I think a lot of people (myself included) have said the 'I love you thing' in a new relationship and then been ok about waiting for a few weeks for the moment when the other person feels that they have reached that point. This doesn't make good telly.

I know that if someone didn't feel able to spontaneously say it to me, after say 6-9 months of the relationship, then I'd probably feel that we weren't going anywhere. Both deeds and words are important. (If you love someone and can't tell them - then you prob need to look at that.)

My sister couldn't cope with the response expectation 'inherent in the system' and so I used to tell her and then immediately say something afterwards so she didn't have to fill the space. It took the pressure off and a few years back I had occasion to tell her that I loved her, filled in the space and she told me to shush and that she loved me too. That meant so much.

If I tell someone I'm in a relationship with, I don't expect anything in return after saying it. But if they stopped saying that they loved me, then I would feel very deprived and unsure.

[ghoti.livejournal.com]

Hmm. I guess I just didn't understand why it needed to be a plot device at all, rather than why it needed to be all done so quickly.

[alison-lees.livejournal.com]

me too. except I'm more inconsistent and confusing. But it's not really been an issue. I think there are times when it has to be replied too (usually more romantic times) and others when it doesn't (I told my children this morning before school that I loved them, as a 'parting shot').

[cartesiandaemon.livejournal.com]

What everyone else said. I think TV massively exaggerates it, but I think it is normal to expect love to be mutual, and given that, when someone says "I love you" is a natural time to say "I love you" yourself. It's like, if someone says "do you know, you're covered in soot" and they're ALSO covered in soot, you COULD not say anything, but it would be weird.

So, I feel strange NOT replying "I love you" but have made an effort not to say it all the time just to avoid feeling obliged to say it, rather saying it when I feel like it.

Or, it's possible to be in a relationship where one person cares a lot more about it than the other, but it's generally problematic long term, so to most people, just saying "i love you", even if free and true, is going to cause trouble if the other person doesn't think something comparable. (And bad enough if this is a relationship forming, let alone a relatiosnhip where you USED to both be committed, but now one isn't -- even if it's not a personal moral failing to stop feeling romantic feelings for someone, it's clear why TV would make it look like it is...) There's obviously better responses than having a massive fight and a break-up, like, say, letting the relationship grow at its own pace, but in TV-world where any emotional upset is immediately followed by a spiral of emotional blackmail and blame, that's what's going to happen :)