ghoti_mhic_uait | Things I don't understand

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Things I don't understand - Valentiner's Day

Someone on a food community I read posted a link to these anatomical heart cupcakes asking whether we thought they'd be suitable for her four year old son to take to school for Valentine's day.

Now, they are utterly awesome, and a quick glance at the ingredients reveals no nuts or peanuts, so I'd think they'd be OK for school, which is how I answered, but...

why would a four year old be taking cakes to school *for Valentine's day*? Why would anyone? We used to (at secondary school) have a board for posting anonymous comments. Apparently I even got one, one year, but I didn'#t have time to go and look until they were all taken down. That is, you post a comment for *one* person, or a small number of people you're interested in romantically or sexually.

The whole class? That would be weird. Four year olds? Also kind of icky.

Any explanations, gratefully received.

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No, they aren't suitable for a four year old to take into school for Valentine's day.
1) Most schools, or LEAs, probably have a policy about 'no sweets'. The icing is likely to have lots of ENumbers, and the parents should be going along with the 'no sweets or excess sugar' rule.
2) Valentines day, as you point out, is aimed at people old enough to be thinking about dating, and about single people. It's not what people insist on making it, for everybody. I have had lots of 'valentine's' artwork, and I have some up on the wall that Hannah did at playschool and in the library, but I don't hold with it myself, I just admire the art work.
3) Most 4 year olds probably haven't encountered an anatomically correct heart picture, and these cakes might confuse them.
4) It's just too icky.

Do you not have cakes on birthdays? We do, if they want to bring them in, and so long as there's no nuts or peanuts.

No: I respected the 'no sweets' rule and very carefully provided fruit, cut up, and party bags. The other mums ignore the ' no sweets' rule and provide sweets or chocolate. They have had cakes at playschool.

Sorry, I was being surprised at the 'no sweets' rule rather than your personal adherence to it. Although when I was at school, noone ever took in birthday cake/sweets.

But if you look at the way things are going, and the 'healthy eating' rules schools are now being asked to go by, I would have thought 'no sweets' was becoming the norm. Although, since the other parents ignore it, perhaps not.

The other reasons not to bring in cakes are: allergies and diets. Some people are allergic to milk, eggs, and butter. Some margerines are not vegetarian. Food colourings have been linked to hyperactivity.

On the other hand, the only objection I'd have is promoting a Hallmark holiday to kids too young to understand the scale of what utter bilge it is. Not that I gave a toss when I was a five-year-old (amongst a class that would all turn six before me) and returned home one day with a tray of biscuits with hearts crudely painted on them with all the skill expected of a five-year-old.

Health and safety? E-numbers? Piles of sugar? A day aimed squarely at singles? And all this at an independent school, in 1985? Such rules and regulations never existed. Life was much simpler then.

I was a bit disturbed to see a young children's comic with a free gift for making Valentine things on it.
I'm afraid it's the commercialism taking over again. They need profits in the gap between Christmas and Easter,so whether it's a heart shaped sandwich or a pinl variation of just about anything they'll try it.
I remember Jade being a bit upset,last year,as some of her friends parents had given their children cards
Weirder and weirder

A UK school, or a US one?

Valentine's day in the US seems to be a whole different ball game. Kids apparently have to give something to everyone else in their class to show how much they love them.

Stores here sell bulk packs of valentine's cards which amused me greatly when I first saw them.

I'm pretty sure they start their valentine's parties at a very early age - perhaps even kindergarten.

Exactly. Everyone gives a valentine to everyone else in the class. In fact, you get in trouble if you don't bring one for each person. You decorate your valentine bag (paper bag) with crayons, markers, etc. and then hang it along the edge of the chalkboard (okay, probably now a whiteboard, but still). And you have a Valentine's party with sweets.

I do agree about the anatomical heart part being confusing for four-year-olds though. Weird.

But they have a teacher, who can explain the hearts thing.

Can you explain why the US valentine's day is as it is, though?

US school. I know that they do it, I just don't understand why.

I fear a blend of crass overcommercialisation and the assumed need to protect the kids who may not get a card/as many cards, gifts and adulation as the popular kids from the realities of life. Both following the lead from the USA (whether intentionally or not).

the hatter

In this case it was an American school. I haven't seen anything like that in the UK.

It isn't an assumed need. I grew up in the era when schools started to implement this policy in the States. You would get one kid who got no Valentines cards, and everyone would comment on it--"look at the loser". So schools started an "everyone or no one" rule. Same thing with birthday parties--if you hand invitations out at school you have to invite the whole class, so kids don't get the double humiliation of not only being uninvited but being shown up in front of the whole class.

You might view it as "protecting kids from the realities of life"; I don't. I WAS the unpopular kid. I already knew it, I just didn't need or want it flaunted and have everyone effectively pointing and saying "HA HA!" It's softening the edges of child cruelty.

Ghoti, unfortunately I don't know why it's become a schoolchildren's thing--all I know is that it was well established when I was at school. We'd give out little cards and candy hearts.

We've all been there. I didn't feel more popular for the joke Valentines I was given occasionally, though.

And thankyou for engaging with the actual question. I feel like I've been whining 'but *why*?' Maybe I should do my own research :)

I was the unpopular kid, too. I was the smart kid. I wasn't the not so cool dressed kid. I suspect a lot of the people reading this were in the same position, certainly a lot of the people I like, love and respect were, and I don't think this is entirely coincidence.

Would you rather have lived that part of your life being humoured by your peers and the system ? I doubt they would have been any less cruel about/to you, turning up at a party where you weren't wanted and been more subtley cruel in writing your v-day card. I certainly wouldn't want people I dislike at my special occassion, nor the meaning of a festival I enjoy diluted to make the adults feel better about kids being kids (or in fact humans being humans). That's pandering to the lowest common denominator, and what makes people who they are is that they're not the same as anyone else. I have a very deep-seated fear that creating unrealistic expectations in children is making the world a worse place to live, and I am not alone in this fear.

the hatter

I don't see it as humouring anyone or giving them unrealistic expectations. It's about not flaunting people's status. If everyone gets a Valentine, you know it's not about friendship so you don't associate any importance to it, positive or negative. Both the negative associations of not receiving and the positive ones of being included are gone. (Of course there are more subtle ways of distinguishing--you give your real friends better cards, etc. But you don't have the one kid there with an empty desk.) You don't think they're your friends--you know better.

And you can still exclude people you don't want--you just can't do it in school. If you can only have 10 people to your party that's fine, but the invitations can't be handed out in class.

If everyone gets a Valentine, you know it's not about friendship

See, that's my problem right there. What's to celebrate if everyone gets it. It's like the jewish or muslim kids getting christmas presents, fine if you see christmas as a festival celebrating buying gifts, not so fine (in fact it seems quite insulting, dismissive and patronising of their beliefs) to people who believe it should be a celebration as the birth of their saviour.

Something similar that more personally galls me, the idea that on your birthday, you bring cake into the office for everyone; yes statistically it involves everyone buying as much cake as if everyone contributes and organises to buy cake for one person on their birthday, but it's your special day, why should you be the one making the effort for the greater good ? I'd would much rather make the effort to make someone else's special day special, even if the effort is a little thing like choosing which cake you think they'd appreciate most.

As for the bit about handing out invites, then good manners would dictate that you employ some tact and decorum if you're not inviting everyone. Should this not be as much a part of school teaching as maths and english ? Punish kids for being rude and obnoxious, for not using common sense and thinking about their actions. Prescriptive law tends to discourage people from taking responsibility for their own actions.

the hatter

I saw an ad on TV last week for 'Get this cute toy for $X when you buy 3 Valentine's cards'. Valentine's day tradition is a bit different in the USA.

What junni and albanach said. It's as much about friendship and all of that here as romantic/sexual. That said, by the time you're an adult there's a big huge monster focus on the romantic. I send V-day cards to some of my friends...

OK, I think I mostly got that. I just don't understand why/where that idea came from. Do you know?

I'm not sure, but it's not a very new thing. the platonic valentines thing was in an (American) activity book I had when I was, umm, 6 or 7? 1980 or so, anyway.

It's definitely not *just* a US thing, though, even if it is more predominantly so. My brother and I were getting Valentine's cards and little presents from my grandparents back in the '70s in the UK, so our family at least had a tradition of the date being one for showing love in general, not only romantic love. Personally I rather like that idea.

As far as I can tell, it's been like that a long time (like at least 20-25 years)--I think my mom has even mentioned that she remembers similiar (but making her own cards).

I guess I always thought of it more as a schoolkids holiday--which I guess is as odd as the idea that V-day is only romantic. Either way, I'd rather ignore it this year. :S

Taking cakes to school seems like a bad move anyway, what with allergies and all.

The reason isn't really because it's Valentine's Day. The reason is really because most schools will try to think of activities that they think that all the children will enjoy (at the same time satisfying the parents) doing together (teaching stuff like team work, sharing, etc.)

Cakes just happen to be something that are popular with children, as well as adults. The day/event is kind of used to help children think on a theme. It's also a more 'responsible' excuse/reason to satisfy parents, rather than just say, 'Let's have cake because we just feel like having some every month.' Some teachers will use the day/event as some theme reason, but others may choose to do something like a 'baking day' every month, where the children will take turns adding ingredients or stirring, etc.

From what I recall, in North American schools, Valentine's Day isn't just about lovers; it's about caring and loving. This would involve activities for the child to show that they cared/loved their family/friends/classmates.

But you don't need a reason to bake; it's called 'having a cookery lesson'. Whether it's every week, every fortnight, or little groups taking in turns depends on the resources available.

The point of my comment to this post, and the point of ghoti's LJ entry (this one) is NOT about baking.

She's got your number, it's aaalllllll about the cake.

the hatter

Cool cakes! We had a Valentine's post box and secondary school. Yay, for turning it into a popularity contest :(

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Things I don't understand - Valentiner's Day

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